20
Jul
07

This is an opinion.

This is an opinion.

These are facts.

3,630 US Soldiers killed in Iraq, 26,806 US Soldiers wounded in Iraq

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40 Responses to “This is an opinion.”


  1. 1 inkyfinger
    July 21, 2007 at 9:41 am

    A beautiful display of the absolute truth. Thank you!

  2. 2 unitedwelay1
    July 21, 2007 at 10:19 am

    This picture made me cry. I have so many friends over there, none of them really sure how they feel deep down about this war. some of them are pro- some con. Either way, it must be incredibly difficult to know, day in and day out, that you are shooting at a people who dod nothing to harm you. They are simply Iraqi. and we need to start calling this what it is – genocide.

  3. July 21, 2007 at 4:02 pm

    Undergroundlogician
    Do you feel better by putting things down.
    If you don’t like the way this site is run then don’t come back. Just like the TV you can turn the channel or turn it off…It’s that EZ.
    Great picture!!!
    “It is the absolute responsibility of everybody in uniform to disobey an order that is either illegal or immoral”
    Gen Peter Pace

  4. 4 unitedwelay1
    July 21, 2007 at 4:46 pm

    UL,
    As long as you make it clear that it’s a opinion, then yes, I will accept that. what I will not accept is pretending that opinions are fact.

    Genocide is foremost an international crime for which individuals, no matter how high in authority, may be indicted, tried, and punished by the International Criminal Court (ICC). According to Article 6 of the ICC Statute, This crime involves, “any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

    (a) Killing members of the group;
    (b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
    (c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;

    I think what we’re doing in Iraq pretty much fits that description, especially since they didn’t attack us.

  5. July 22, 2007 at 6:41 am

    Does UL = Antifreeway blogger = TROLL ?

  6. July 22, 2007 at 10:18 pm

    “If the military of the U.S. has acted shamefully in killing innocents and trying to wipe out a race, then you should rejoice at the deaths of our military personnel, and desire more of them to meet their final doom.”

    Seriously, this notion that those who hate the policy must also hate the soldiers is truly a tedious one. When my mother cooked liver for supper, I didnt blame the frying pan or the serving platter for putting it on my plate. I blamed my mother, who insisted on serving the damn stuff. Regularly.

    This “catastrophic failure in Iraq” can be stopped, at least our part in it, fairly easily, simply by leaving. Yes, there may be (ok, will be) bloodshed after, but while the opportunity for bloodshed that might be our fault due to our inept invasion of the country, the actual killing will not be, because we will not be there doing it.

    And I dont know who brought it up, but what’s going on in Iraq is not genocide. It’s ugly, it’s brutal, and it’s deadly, but unless the Turks go in after the Kurds (and perhaps not even then), it is not genocide. It’s war.

  7. July 23, 2007 at 11:42 am

    Politics aside, my problem with this photo is that the soldier defaced the very flag he was sworn to protect. He could have got his message across just as well with a sign in front of the flag.

  8. July 23, 2007 at 10:49 pm

    “…the ramifications of an early withdrawl would be castrophic, immoral, and unnecessary.”

    This sounds more like the ramifications of our entry into Iraq.

    I’ve stated before that we should fix what we’ve broken in Iraq. Unfortunately, to do so would require far more soldiers (i.e., a draft), far more money (a tax increase and resource rationing), and far less corruption (more transparency, less outsourcing) than America is willing to commit to (or even consider). The most sensible thing (on the cheap) that we can do at this point is get out, let the Iraqis come to their own political and social balance, and send money (how about this: an oil deal with Iraq where they sell us oil directly, with no American oil corporation skimming [huge] profits as middle man?).

    And yes, I do hate George Bush. I do not hate the military. How many times must this be said? The military’s presence in Iraq is an obscenity, not because of the soldiers, but because of the policy. Considering the level of stress that our people are under, and the ever-increasing lengths and quantities of their tours, I’m rather surprised just how low the level of attrocities seem to be. War is Hell, and when you have a war, you will have attrocities. But the blame for the war (which leads to the attrocities) does not lay at the feet of the soldiers, but rather at the feet of the politicians who were unable to avoid said war, including George Bush, who without any doubt now, lied about the reasons for going to war.

    @ Ed: the flag is a symbol of our nation, and as such is only as good as our reputation. This soldier merely wrote upon it. The Bush Administration, through it’s policies, has made the U.S. dispised all over the world. Who do think has done more damage to the nation or to what the flag symbolizes, that soldier or BushCo?

  9. July 24, 2007 at 12:56 am

    These are facts.

    3,630 US Soldiers killed in Iraq, 26,806 US Soldiers wounded in Iraq

    And this is another opinion. I can’t imagine the horrors Mrs. Z’s best friend imagines every time she hears American soldiers die in Iraq and she’s wondering if it’s her hubby.

  10. 11 Cranky Yankee
    July 24, 2007 at 2:37 am

    Ed. – Soldiers are not sworn to protect the flag… I don’t know where you got that idea. Military members are sworn to defend the U.S. constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic and to obey the orders of the president and the offices appointed over them. I took that oath 4 times, it kind of stuck with me…

  11. July 24, 2007 at 8:24 am

    “I Pledge Allegiance to the flag of the United States of America…”

    Haven’t we all said that once upon a time? Does the military not adhere to the Pledge of Allegiance?

    The Flag Code states, “The flag should never have placed upon it, nor on any part of it, nor attached to it any mark, insignia, letter, word, figure, design, picture, or drawing of any nature.”

    DaveAwayFromHome – Yes I think Bush has done way more damage to our country than the soldier in the picture through misuse of the flag. But like I said, politics aside, he defaced the flag in violation of the flag code and could have gotten his message across in better ways.

  12. July 24, 2007 at 2:58 pm

    Personally, this concern over the sacredness of the flag strikes me as too much like idolatry. A flag is, ultimately, merely a symbol of a country, and can only represent what that country represents. If that country has problems, then no amount of “respect” for its symbols can correct that, it can only make those who look no deeper than symbols feel better about themselves, which doesnt help anybody.

  13. 15 Cranky Yankee
    July 25, 2007 at 8:43 am

    Dave – It is idolatry and idiocy, No one is “sworn” to defend it. That notion is a symptom of a mindset that craves authority and symbols thereof.

    Ed – The pledge is as laughable as the legality of “In God we Trust.” It and the Flag Code are not enforceable by any law that restricts the freedom of speech of the individual. The flag code is a guideline and the pledge is for the indoctrination of our youth. Your only argument is that the problem with this picture is that it defiles a sacred object. It is a deflection from the real argument. Good luck with that.

  14. July 25, 2007 at 4:51 pm

    Great image, ignore the nobjobs UWL.

  15. July 27, 2007 at 12:01 am

    “I [state your name] do hereby swear to defend and protect the Constitution of the United States of America…..”

    the Flag is a symbol but it isn’t what I was serving while I was there.

    Did the guy holding that flag actually go to Iraq or is he one of those who has decided he is a “conscientious objector” when actually called to serve after taking Military pay and benefits for years?

  16. 18 unitedwelay1
    July 27, 2007 at 9:44 am

    Dept,
    I don’t think so. He’s arrogant, but not malicious.

  17. 19 unitedwelay1
    July 27, 2007 at 10:00 am

    “…then you should rejoice at the deaths of our military personnel…”

    I don’t know what kind of funky God you’re serving, but as for me and my household, we do not rejoice in harm coming to anyone, even someone whose ideas differ from ours, and especially not if they have so selflessly chosen to risk their lives in defense of their country (though they are, in no way, defending our country by being in Iraq). Also, why I would wish death upon some of my closest friends or members of my family is an idea tha is beyond me. Every person has value. It is the American government that seems to have forgotten this, NOT me.

    Dave,
    I brought up Genocide. What’s going on in Iraq certainly mimics genocide, even if it does not fit all the criteria.

    On the flag,
    I will not say the Pledge of Alliegance and neither will my children. First, they may pledge alliegence to their country, but NOT their flag. The flag is a symbol of a government, and nothing more. It represents the country, but it is NOT the essence of that country. To pledge to defend it is silly. To deface it is an act of free speech and should not be limited, no matter who does it, and to wave it in support of the troops is literally the least you can do. Second, we are not one nation under god.

  18. 20 unitedwelay1
    July 27, 2007 at 10:01 am

    Exmi,
    Actually in Iraq. Served, foughht, lost friends, and did NOT have the same experience you did years ago.

  19. 21 unitedwelay1
    July 27, 2007 at 10:05 am

    “…the ramifications of an early withdraw would be catastrophic, immoral, and unnecessary…” I agree with Dave. Also, the Iraqi government has said, when not coerced by the US government, that they would welcome the withdraw of the American troops, immediately if possible.

  20. July 27, 2007 at 3:14 pm

    Ok, I was wondering.

    Please note, PARTS of the Iraqi government say they want the US to pull out at once. Generally members of the more extreme Shiite political factions. Not those empowered to speak for the government as a whole.

  21. July 27, 2007 at 3:53 pm

    Did you hear what happened to these people for expressing their opinion?

    http://www.citizen-times.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=200770725118

  22. 24 unitedwelay1
    July 28, 2007 at 8:00 am

    The President of Iraq said that the US could withdraw at any time. I don’t really thing that represents only part of the government. Does our President only represent part of our government when he speaks for the nation?

    OP,
    I’m in the middle of some family stuff involving my sister and wo’t have a free minute until Monday, but I promise to check it out.

  23. 25 unitedwelay1
    July 31, 2007 at 9:50 am

    “To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”

    – Theodoore Roosevelt

  24. 26 unitedwelay1
    July 31, 2007 at 9:51 am

    Why not show the flag being desecrated? To desecrate your flag is a last resort for a soldier, something you do out of desperation, only when you have exhausted all other means of communication. it says, “I am ashamed of my country, the country I would so selflessly give my life for, the country I swore to protect and defend. My entire purpose for being has been dishonored. And you, the very people I chose to give my life for, have done this to me.” I think the statement is clear.

  25. August 1, 2007 at 5:08 pm

    Can I steal and post this picture? With proper credit to you, of course.

  26. 28 unitedwelay1
    August 1, 2007 at 9:18 pm

    It’s not mine to give away, but I don’t think the soldier in question would have a problem with it.

  27. August 2, 2007 at 2:39 pm

    UWL,
    Have you seen this about child abuse among military families? Link

  28. 30 unitedwelay1
    August 2, 2007 at 6:03 pm

    I hadn’t sen it, but now that I have, I hope you don’t mind if I write a post about it.

  29. 31 Father of a real soldier
    October 31, 2007 at 8:59 pm

    http://www.legion.org/documents/legion/pdf/flagcode.pdf

    As the father of a real soldier I am disqusted with this picture and you anti-american jerks that think anything about this is correct. Read the US Flag code. I put the link above for those of you too stupid to find it. It is very clear that this so called soldier is violating several codes of ethics including his oath as a solider. Any real soldier would remove the flag from this traitor and tear the uniform from his body.

    Any soldier that thinks this is acceptable obviously did not join the military for the true reason. You must have thought joiniing up would be a good way to get some benifits. When suddenly you actually have to serve and protect the country you swore you would, you want to find some reason to discrace real soldiers. No war has ever been “OK” without killing. But unfortunately there are still those in the world that would like to kill every American including you ass holes.

    This photo, the imitation soldier in it, and those of you that support it are traitors to the United States of America. Go to hell. Godspeed to our real soldiers.
    Father of a true American

  30. 32 Jake
    April 17, 2008 at 7:16 pm

    This picture is disgusting. Dont enlist and then cry and complain when you have a job to do.

  31. 33 unitedwelay1
    May 1, 2008 at 7:12 am

    I respect you feelings, but I have family in the army, too. There’s no need to be disrespectful of those who exercise their right to free speech, even if you disagree. You seem to forget that one of the founding principles of American military service is best stated by Voltaire, “I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.”

  32. March 18, 2010 at 9:56 am

    As the father of a real soldier I am disqusted with this picture and you anti-american jerks that think anything about this is correct.

    So, then, you don’t think your son has any First Amendment rights?

    Yeah, it’s a violation of the flag code. So was Bush’s autographing American flags. Putting a flag decal on your car is a violation of the flag code, too, and especially flying a U.S. flag from the window of your car until it’s just red, white and blue shreds.

    It’s a violation of U.S. law to commit a war crime, too. Why do you selectively pick parts of the flag code to adhere to, and why do you ignore so much more of U.S. law, which that flag is supposed to represent?

  33. 35 Zac
    January 20, 2011 at 7:37 pm

    Look…. this is for everyone to read, comment on, and tear apart as you see necessary. I am an American citizen and I have been taken care of by my country, my family, and God. I have grown up with a set of standards that have led me to believe that service to one’s country, regardless of what kind of service that may be, is an honorable thing. Right now we are at war. If Bush did choose to go into Iraq because of some oil scandal, then he will receive proper punishment in hell for the wrongs he has done, but let him deal with own problems. Right now we are faced with an undeniably evil group. We are fighting a group of people who want nothing more than to kill every last “infidels” a.k.a. anyone who does not convert to Islam. They are radicals that want nothing, but total control over the world, and yet we lack courage, strength, and wisdom in this country. In WWII we fought Hitler because he was mass killing Jews, homosexuals, and handicapped people. He was brainwashing men and women to believe a false idea and millions were killed because of Hitler. We went in and beat the hell out of the kraut bastards and showed them that you aren’t allowed to fuck with the world and get away with it forever. Right now we are facing an entire population of Islamic bastards that want to rid the world of us. We do not, can not, and will not face this truth. Regardless of whatever Bush has done, we are at war. We must put all differences and quarrels aside and go rid the world of evil people and rise together as a strong nation as we have in the past. I say that we are not a country undone, we are a strong country filled with proud people and the thought of losing it to anyone brings tears to my eyes and calls me fight with tenacity unmeasured. America is a beautiful place where you can make something of yourself and the very nature of it has swept people onto rickety boats to cross treacherous seas. We must honor our ancestors and preserve our country. We will never be undone by ignorant quarrels such as those above me. Put differences and opinions aside and humble yourselves. We are a country under attack and we must unite again and back our men and women and join them in the fight. God Bless America and all of my American brothers and sisters.

    -Zachary Miller 20yrs old, Central Ohio

  34. 36 unitedwelay1
    January 21, 2011 at 6:35 pm

    Zac, for those of us who don’t believe in hell, we’d much rather he have a real and fitting punishment here on earth.

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    We’re at university together http://ujakymey.de.tl preteem bbs sex list Love how he manhandled her ass but not a fan of that pumped pussy look. Maybe it feels good to her but ugh.


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